@AdmiralZod1

you need to take a closer look. Look at her eyes and you will see tears forming.

You're right. I stand corrected. I needed a higher resolution picture. However, by what reason do you believe that Amity's concern was for Hunter? Luz was next to Hunter when he died and was revived and she was in tears. How do you know it wasn't Luz Amity was concerned for? That would be more consistent with Amity's behavior after Grom. After all, when Hunter was revived and Luz walked away Amity's attention stayed on her. Amity expressed no concern for Hunter whatsoever. She went straight to Luz and asked her about her keeping her secret about Belos.

Also, Luz did not plan on leaving Amity for months, she did so right before Halloween when everyone said they wanted to go on the Haunted Hayride. She wasn’t conspiring to get rid of Amity and the others the moment she got back from the Human Realm.

Camila: Baby? No, no, no, no, no, no... [Luz is pulled back further.] When you come home, promise you'll stay here. I didn't mean to push you away. I swear things will be different.

Luz: [Starts tearing up.] Mom, it's not you, it never was!

Camila: Promise me, Luz... please!

Luz: [Sad expression.] Okay, Mom. I promise. [Fades away from view.]

This is from Yesterday's Lie where Luz promises her mother she will stay with her.

Luz: Amity, Amity! Amity, you saved me. How can I make it up to you?

Amity: Maybe... you can tell me about this. [Amity pulls out Luz's phone, with the video still displayed on the screen.]

Luz: [Gasps.]

Amity: Don't worry. I haven't watched it. But... you did finish the portal door. You did see your mom. ...And... it looks like it didn't go well.

Luz: I'm sorry.

Amity: I know this situation is crazy, and I'm okay taking things one day at a time. But, I can't help if I don't know what's going on.

Luz: You just looked so hopeful. You were even learning Spanish. And I thought if I helped out Kikimora, maybe there'd be hope for me.

Amity: Tell me what happened.

Luz: Okay. So, I had finished the door. But it didn't look like the normal portal. I must have missed something. We opened it and...

This is from Follies at the Coven Day Parade where Luz has been contemplating the possibility of leaving the Demon Realm or lying to her mother. She knows that returning to the Human Realm permanently is a real possibility. She knows that eventually she's going to have to choose between her mother and Amity and she made a promise to her mother.

Luz: Dear Diary, all I ever wanted was to be good at something, to be around people who also liked that something. And when I found the Demon Realm, I-I though, "Wow, I found it. I can learn magic. I can be a witch. I-I won't be the dummy in the principal's office anymore!" But I messes up too much, and put everyone in danger. Mama says I need to learn from my mistakes. [A single tear falls down her cheek.] So, I know what I have to do now...

Luz: Mama says I have to learn from my mistakes. So, I know what I have to do now. On Halloween, after the Hayride, I'm telling everyone I'm staying in the Human Realm. Permanently.

This is from Thanks to Them where Luz makes the decision. This is a decision she's been contemplating since Hollow Mind where she learned of her own role in Belos' past. So Luz has been anticipating this decision for months since it was motivated by Luz learning of her influence on Belos back in Hollow Mind and finally worked it out in Thanks to Them. Her statement, "I know what I have to do now...", shows that she's been thinking about this for as long has she's known about her influence on Belos and has finally come to a decision.

Also, how is telling her about how she helped crucial information to defeating Belos? It is good that they knew but how would that be of use on the upcoming battle. That doesn’t make much sense since that info doesn’t really put either Belos or the Collector at a disadvantage.

Luz knew none of that. All she knew was that she had information about Belos that Amity didn't and that Amity was going back to fight Belos without her. Luz had no way of knowing what was on the other side of the portal or what Amity would be facing so she had no way of knowing how important the information she had on Belos would be. Therefore denying Amity even that tiny scrap of information could be putting her at a disadvantage. Luz didn't know and had she gone through with her plan she would never know.

Also Luz, didn’t keep the truth out of ego. She did so out of self-loathing. After learning the truth, Luz blamed herself for Belos’s atrocities even though it wasn’t her fault. She was hating herself and didn’t tell her friends because she couldn’t think they would forgive her when she couldn’t forgive herself. She loves her friends and didn’t want to loose many of the only ones she had made in her entire life.

The hell she didn't.

Amity: Um, Luz. What did Belos mean when he said you helped him meet the Collector? I mean, that was a lie, right?

Luz: No, it was true. [walks away] If it weren't for me, the Day of Unity would have never happened. There was this time pool, and I met him. I met him when he was still just Philip, and I taught him the light spell. I introduced him to the Collector. I set everything in motion. I'm sorry, everyone.

Amity: Why did you keep all that a secret?

Luz: I was scared. I thought you'd all hate me for it. Which is why I've made a decision. I think it'd be in everyone's best interest if I-

It was more important to Luz that she not be hated than to insure that the people she cared about were as best prepared as possible to fight an enemy that would kill them all without hesitation. People she was planning to abandon at the portal. Every reason you cited for Luz keeping that information to herself was internal to Luz herself. She was thinking exclusively about herself and not what the rest of them were up against.

Plus, most of the events that Luz is shown smiling during Thanks to Them, happen when Amity is around, because her presence is that comforting to Luz. She was going to stay behind not because she didn’t genially care for her, but because she believed she would only put her and the others in more danger if she stayed around them. That misguided and tragic, but hardly selfish, rather it’s selfless.

No. Selfless would have been Luz setting her personal concerns aside and doing everything she could to prepare them for their upcoming battle regardless of the cost to herself. Even if it meant they did hate her it wouldn't matter. That's what selflessness is. Luz protected herself and she was doing that at their expense.

If she did, one can only imagine how harmful that would be for her mentally. She lost her beloved girlfriend and the friends, would be cut off from the only friends she ever made in her entire life, be cut off from the place she truly considers home, and would never find out if her brother and mother survived. I think it’s obvious, and realistic as you would prefer, that would extremely damaging to Luz’s mental health, especially when it was damaged at the time with her unnecessary sense of guilt and worrying over King, Eda, and everyone else in the Demon Realm.

Luz mental health was already damaged. She had serious unaddressed issues with grief that set her firmly on a course that would have led to her eventual arrest and incarceration if there wasn't an intervention. Escaping to a fantasy world where she'd never have to grow up or face consequences for her actions would have done far more damage because Luz would have no restraints.

Luz always had the ability to make friends. Vee proved that in Yesterday's Lie. Luz herself proved it in I was a Teenage Abomination. Luz losing contact with the people she knew in the Boiling Isles does not condemn her to a friendless existence nor would it be damaging to her mental health. Luz situation would be no different from a person moving away from the place they grew up to build a life for themselves elsewhere. She would be in the same situation that the Calamity Trio was in when they graduated middle school and when they left Amphibia for the last time. They formed new friend groups and moved on with their lives just like everybody does when they grow up and move on. Friends come and go in your life. That's the way it is for all of us. That's the way it would have been for Luz.

Amity didn't empathize with Hunter. She barely had anything to do with him over the series. Amity was focused only on Luz. By her own admission she went to Eclipse Lake to prove that she was an awesome girlfriend. That was all Amity did for the rest of the series. That was the problem with Amity as a character. They took a three dimensional character and flattened her into a love interest for the protagonist. If she were as empathetic as you claim where was her empathy for Willow? She put that girl through hell for nine years and then almost killed her. One episode where she is briefly nice to Hunter doesn't negate her history with both Willow and Hunter over the rest of the series where she barely had anything to do with anyone other than Luz to include Hunter.

@Hawas1983 And how was anything Luz learned about in Hollow Mind in terms of her helping Belos gonna help them?

Like, how would that information remotely be helpful in the final battle to begin with?

@RadicalPatMan

I must also note that even if Luz didn't go back to the Demon Realm, she was gonna give Amity and the others a heads up about it first before Camila interrupted her (due to feeling guilty about pushing her in that direction).

Yes. Luz was about to tell them about her decision and she was going to do it at the last possible minute when no one could to anything about it. The portal was going to close never to open again meaning that unless the others wanted to spend the rest of their lives in the Human Realm they had only moments to get through the portal.

She could have told Amity this was on her mind immediately after Hollow Mind giving Amity an opportunity to at least prepare herself emotionally for the prospect of permanent separation from Luz but Luz didn't have the decency to give Amity that much. She was going to dump Amity into a cold bath at a time she would have to make the most important decision of her life.

Since you place so much stock on Luz lying to Amity, what did you think of how Adventure Time handled Finn lying to Flame Princess? Or Avatar showing Aang lying to Katara?

I place so much stock in Luz lying to Amity because lying to an intimate partner is a serious matter that can potentially end the relationship. I can't comment on Adventure Time as I never got into that series but in Avatar: The Last Airbender Aang and Katara weren't intimate partners. Again, that's the difference.

Luz and Amity are supposed to be in a relationship where trust is fundamental. Luz is betraying that trust and she's doing it repeatedly. Raine walked away when Eda did that to them despite the love they still had for Eda. Lying to an intimate partner who has placed the entirety of their trust in you is an unconscionable act of disrespect and neither Luz nor Amity seem to be aware of how vital respect is to any relationship much less an intimate one.

@Hawas1983 Im sorry but to say she was crying for Luz is a pretty weak argument. She along with everyone else was in tears when Flapjack died. Her eyes were focused on him and Hunter not Luz. Plus, she only looked at Luz when everyone knew that Hunter was fine and only after Luz walked away. To say she was crying over just Luz and not Flapjack is just utterly unfounded. Luz was no longer in any danger and was not seriously hurt unlike Flapjack.

Also, you have been given amble evidence that Amity sympathized with Hunter, just as she has done for her father and siblings and even Boscha during S3E2 despite the animosity she was feeling towards her.

Also, you haven’t answered the question that I and @RadicalPatMan have asked. How would Luz telling them about Hollow Mind give them an advantage over Belos and the Collector? How would denying this info to her friends put them at a disadvantage?

Perhaps you are right to say Luz should have opened up more, but that doesn’t make her selfish. By that standard Hunter is selfish too since he didn’t open up to anyone about being Belos’s genetic brother by way of cloning, or what Luz did. He could have kept his origins a secret and still reveal the truth about Luz too. Does that make him selfish and only thinking about himself? Does being a Grimwalker give them an tactical advantage against Belos and the Collector?

Hunter and Luz protected each other, and both never intended to hurt their friends. Maybe they should have opened up more, but their reasons for doing so are completely understandable given the trauma they went through.

Ultimately your argument about Amity being a sociopath is incorrect. Honestly, do you feel like Luz is a sociopath because many of the things you have said of her imply this.

@Hawas1983 Also, can we not have this argument again, about Vee and Luz’s friends in Gravesfield. Neither of us are going to convince the other of our respective opinions, as I have told you before

Also, can we not have this argument again, about Vee and Luz’s friends in Gravesfield. Neither of us are going to convince the other of our respective opinions, as I have told you before

No. That you find it an inconvenient truth doesn't invalidate it as an argument. The fact remains that Vee's experience on earth completely invalidates the idea that Luz was a bullied outcast on earth which was the point of the episode. Your headcanon about Luz is not actual canon and Yesterday's Lie proves it.

@Hawas1983 first off I have warned you about your fowl language. Do it again and I will inform the administrators of your cursing and let them decide if you should be punished for this or not. I implore you to show self restraint.

Second, so she clasped her hands to her mouth and she’d tears when seeing a friend of her’s die to save another. She did the same thing everyone else did, crying as Flapjack gave his life for Hunter’s. I seriously don’t know how you can deny this at this point.

Also, Amity is not a sociopath as I and @RadicalPatMan and many other users have voiced time over. Amity was a bully, but she has shown empathy and love towards her friends, girlfriend, and family, yet you keep denying it out of hatred for her character and the writing of the show not fitting your more “realistic” tastes.

And barely knew him? She and Hunter spent months together in the Human Realm and you’re saying she hardly knows him. That is a very weak argument. Even if they aren’t best friends they are still friends and Amity cares about his wellbeing.

And again, it’s obvious I can’t convince you of this, but Amity did feel remorse. She admitted remorsefully that she was too weak to be Willow’s friend, called her her friend when standing up to her mother, tried to protect her and outright stated she wanted to stay her friend, and the two have fought side by side, and even hang out now again, with the two happily dancing and jumping together in joy in S3E2.

Also, I have pointed out numerous canon examples of Amity showing empathy towards others besides Luz, which you have never responded too.

@Hawas1983 forgive me for saying this, but once again you shown you have no regard for other’s opinions. I have tried numerous times to simply agree to disagree but you can’t let it go.

And Luz was bullied. She was made fun of for her “cheesy” attempts to impress past crushes (S2E8), had encounters with other teens that made her have panic attacks even through indirect human interaction (S2E10), and it was shown that even when her quirks were harmless adults in Gravesfield openingly insulted her in public and without care that her mom was right by them (S3E1)

One of the main themes of the Ole House is resisting conformity, which was the basis of the first episode with the Conformitorium and Warden Wrath. You have said you adhere to the canon, and the canon sets Luz up as someone who is misunderstood and doesn’t fit in who finds a place where she belongs.

I get you don’t like the way the series left, but all the hate on this wiki is unnecessary

And I implore you to show self-restraint and respect others views, especially when they try to make peace and simply agre to disagree.

@RadicalPatMan @Hawas1983 Once again, this has gotten grisly off topic from this page so I feel the best thing to do is simply get back on track. Hunter did not deserve to end up like this. I truly feel sorry for him

@Pythorback22 I apologize for this, and hope you feel we haven’t ruined your post